zephyr straight 6 - alt gearbox's

[32chris]

are there any ??
picked up my freebie engine - thanks again Pike :) had it running so all's joyous in the garage of chris :D
looking at the original box it soon became clear that i'm never gonna fathom out how to connect all the levers to a different shifter, so..........
is there a later box (manual or auto) - sierra has been mentioned, that with a little bit of voodoo will fit ??
cheers
chris :)

[eeb43]

sierra box goes on the straight 6 bellhousing

[32chris]

wicked - thanks Mark

oh - is that the type 9 box or the mt whatever it is ?? :)

[movinghotrods]

sierra 4 speed type e box ?? or 5 speed

[32chris]

there's a type e as well :confused:

[FlatheadFordV8]

If you want it really easy, get a Mk1 Transit V4 box, as the case is a floor change version of the Zephyr box.

Use the Transit case, cover and stick, together with the gears, front and rear of your Zephyr box, and you have a Zephyr floor change box. :)

Hope this helps.

Pete

[32chris]

this is strange un-charted ground for me so it all helps - thanks Pete :)

[langysrodshop]

If you want a MT75 box Chris i have one here, Yours for a drink

[kapri]

If you want it really easy, get a Mk1 Transit V4 box, as the case is a floor change version of the Zephyr box.

Use the Transit case, cover and stick, together with the gears, front and rear of your Zephyr box, and you have a Zephyr floor change box. :)

Hope this helps.

Pete


I was going to say that !! I used to own a rare factory Mk3 floorchange Farnham estate.

[eeb43]

If you want a MT75 box Chris i have one here, Yours for a drink

unfortunately the mt75 dosent have a removable bellhousing

[rem]

How many levers are there then Chris? I've got a floor shifter from a Scimitar 4-speed here that can't have more than 3 levers on it.

Don't forget I've got some door latches for you.

[32chris]

its got 3 levers Andy, i dont know which one's do what tho :confused:

haven't forgot the latches mate, just let me know ehich evening is best for you and i'll pop over and square it up with you - thanks again btw :)

[Mart]

3 levers down the side?
Front one would be 3rd/top.
middle one would be 1st/2nd.
rear one would be reverse. (normally smaller)
Usa style floor shifter could probably be adapted?

Mart.

[Klunk]

As if by magic, look what appears in the for sale section:-

Type E gearbox (http://www.nsra.org.uk/newforum/showthread.php?t=13297)

Assuming that is the type you need?

[rem]

its got 3 levers Andy, i dont know which one's do what tho :confused:

haven't forgot the latches mate, just let me know ehich evening is best for you and i'll pop over and square it up with you - thanks again btw :)

I'd go with what Mart says, and also say the reverse lever would only have two detentes, and the other two would have three (this assumes that the internal shift mechanism is such that it will only allow one gear to be engaged at a time!).

That Type E box looks 'kin long - if that is the only tailshaft/shifter available for them I reckon the shift lever would be behind the seat in the Modified! :)

(PS Wednesday evening would be best, or early Thursday?)

[Blackjack]

I have a Zephyr straight six with a three speed floor change box - happy to post pictures or search for numbers if that would help.

[32chris]

thanks for all the input guys, guess i'll look for a transit box 1st, failing that i'll see if i can borrow a sierra box to offer up, see where the g/stick ends up :)

Andy, can you pm me your no please, incase i get lost :D oh, thursday sounds good, bout 4 ok ??

thanks again
chris :)

[Taildragger]

thanks for all the input guys, guess i'll look for a transit box 1st, failing that i'll see if i can borrow a sierra box to offer up, see where the g/stick ends up :)

Andy, can you pm me your no please, incase i get lost :D oh, thursday sounds good, bout 4 ok ??

thanks again
chris :)
I have a MK2 Transit box for sale

[chaley]

Chris, I wouldn't sweat it as to where the lever ends up, with one of my engine swaps the lever was almost in the boot, it's easy enough to sort have a look at this Linky thing (http://www.nsra.org.uk/newforum/showthread.php?t=6568) hope it helps.
Chaley

[kapri]

You can get a Transit 2 box that will stick the lever right up the front.Can't remember if the bellhousing bolts line up but pretty sure the bellhousing will swap off one box to the other . You;ll need a clutch plate to match the box but using the Zeph cover, bearing , clutch arm and hydraulic set up.

[Paul G]

I have a diagram of how the Zephyr linkages go together if you are struggling.

[32chris]

cheers guys, any info would be cool thanks :)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Turbo-Diesel-Transit-DI-2-5-Engine-and-Gearbox_W0QQitemZ220272566123QQcmdZViewItem?hash=i tem220272566123&_trkparms=72%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C24 0%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

sorry for the ebay linky (not mine) but is this the gearbox that fits the zeph b/housing ?? it looks very similar to the zeph box - other than having a g/stick poking out of it that is, with the 4 staggered holes on the top but its bolted to a diesel and not a v4 so :confused:

thanks again
chris

[1930 vicky]

Been going down this road as well for the past couple of weeks and managed to pick up a MK3 zephyr floor change box for Rosie's 27T,Ive been informed that the bell housings wont interchange the only difference is the clutch mechanism is on the opposite side,I use a MK3 clutch plate and use a MK3 prop uj as they are a finer spline.The only thing that dosnt line up is the top starter bolt but a smaller dia bolt can be passed thro and used instead.
The transit box does not have as good a ratios as the Zephyr and I have been told you have to change the main driveshaft in the gearbox to make them fit.
The MK3 uses an american style shift mechanism and I have been told that you can also fit the Transit shift to the side of the gearbox.

I got my box from Goldendays - (John Blythe). Classic Ford Specialists
The Garage
Dereham Road
Easton
Norwich
Norfolk
NR9 5EJ
UK
Tel 01603 881155

Give him a ring what he dos'nt know about english fords aint worth knowing.
Hope this helps.

[kapri]

Well I know you can bolt a 'normal' Ford bellhousing to a Mk 2 Zephyr box so , theoretically , I can't see why it won't work the other way round as the hole pitch inside the bellhousing should be the same.

Yup, Transit gears are lower but think about your overall back axle ratio. If you haven't changed the diff in the back axle but have fitted tall tyres then each gear will be really tall compared to original. By fitting the lower geared Transit box you gain back the ratios plus acceleration and 4th is 1:1 anyway. The taller rear tyres will still give you an 'overdriven type gear compared to the original ratios.

As you are retaining the original Zeph b/h the starter motor / ring gear will all still line up no probs.

[32chris]

iv tried 3 different ford b/housing's so far and none of them will bolt up to the zeph box' - have i got an odd gearbox ???

you answered my next question Kev, as far as the ratio's in the tranny box are concerned, my axle is a common 8" ford with prob something like 3-1 ratio and my rear tyres are 820-15's, the std zeph motor aint gonna be no rocket ship so maybe i'll need the transit ratio's just to be able to pull away :D

thanks again for the input guys :)

[kapri]

All the 'Kent' based boxes through OHC to the V6 Zody boxes all share the same b/h bolt pattern. Now I've never physicaly bolted one to a Consul / Zephyr box myself but a mate did when fitting a Pinto and wanting to retain the column shift.

The only Zephyr box I had access to locally got the engine fitted back in last week so I can't even measure the pitch for you to confirm either way.

It may be neccessary to redrill to suit , do any of the holes line up ?

Also the last time I got involed with a Transit was an OHC engine that came from one fitted with a forward shift 4 speed and it had an adapter plate bolted to the back of the engine. It might be the Transit box doesn't have a removeable bellhousing so needs an adapter anyway?

Eeb 43 might be able to help with the answer to that one?

When I sold the engine and box from my old Zephyr many moons ago the bloke that bought it ( rare freewheeling overdrive box ) had been living abroad when his box packed in and had modified a later Vauhall 4 speed floor change to fit on the back. I can't remember what model he said as it was a good 25 years ago :eek:.

[Paul G]

Scratch that last comment , the rain got into my manual :mad: .It was one of those big burgandy dealer ones aswell :( . It's a good thing that there ain't much Zephyr left on my Zephyr :D

[FlatheadFordV8]

cheers guys, any info would be cool thanks :)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Turbo-Diesel-Transit-DI-2-5-Engine-and-Gearbox_W0QQitemZ220272566123QQcmdZViewItem?hash=i tem220272566123&_trkparms=72%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C24 0%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

sorry for the ebay linky (not mine) but is this the gearbox that fits the zeph b/housing ?? it looks very similar to the zeph box - other than having a g/stick poking out of it that is, with the 4 staggered holes on the top but its bolted to a diesel and not a v4 so :confused:

thanks again
chris

Chris

This whole thread seems to be getting a little out of hand.

The V4 Transit box used the same casing as the left hand drive version of the Mk3 Zephyr, but with a stick instead of the three levers, so it will fit your bellhousing. Your gearbox should look like the one in the attached photo. This shows the Transit box and a Mk3 Zephyr box.

I have just offered a Mk3 Zephyr bellhousing ( 211E-7505-B ) up to a Transit V4 gearbox and the holes line up fine.

The basic gearbox internals were used in all sorts of vehicles from that time, but they changed slightly for different engines, using different input shafts, and ratios.

If you get the V4 case with the part number 212E-7006-G on the side, you can fit all of the Zephyr parts to it, i.e. bellhousing, nose, gears, tailshaft etc.

You then have what was a Mk3 Zephyr LHD gearbox, with your original ratios and a floor change. :D

The same case was used in some Mk2 transit models, using a different tail shaft, and even some with overdrive. The Mk2 also had a reversing light switch added if you need one.

The box on ebay is the type of case you need, if it does not go for too much.

Hope this clears things up.

Pete

[1930 vicky]

That must be a MK3 column change box in your photo,as my mk3 floorchange box has the levers all on the other side.I will post a picture tonight if it will help anyone.

[FlatheadFordV8]

The black box in the picture is a RHD MK3 column change box, which we are assuming Chris has, and the other box is the Mk1 Transit floor change box.

The LHD MK3 column change box used the same case as the Transit, and had the levers on the other side. The Transit as you can see had the stick going straight into the box. 1930 vicky's box is presumably a LHD column change box with the floor change mechanism added, if the levers are on the left.

It seems that Ford have found several different ways to remove the outer covering from the proverbial feline.

Pete

[FlatheadFordV8]

Chris,

You have a PM.

Pete

[1930 vicky]

Some pictures as promised the box was from a RHD mk3 Zephyr.
This whole thread has been really helpfull,thanks guys.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r130/matthewlake/DSCF3697.jpg
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r130/matthewlake/DSCF3698.jpg
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r130/matthewlake/DSCF3699.jpg

[kapri]

Wow, that photo brought memories flooding back of all the good times withour old floor change Mk 3 Farnham estate. All that from a gearbox photo ....really must get out more. :(

[32chris]

that would look just lovely sat on my bench instead of yours Nick :D

[rem]

Well, most of this has gone straight over my head - when did Ford start their policy of making everything far more complicated than it needs to be?

Anyway, if it is of any help I have a Scimitar SE6/SE6A bellhousing and shifter here? I had the overdrive and output shaft, so the box is gone I think. The shifter style is like that one in '30 Vicky's photo, but the arms are longer, although they are the same side.

[kapri]

Not complicated Andy, Ford love 'parts bin' engineering and most stuff interchanges ,it's just knowing which bits you need to interchange that's challenging :)