1968 Hillman Hunter V8 Black Magic

[eviltwin]

what brakes are fitted to the front of the car?
neil.

Apparently they are supposed to be Jag. But when pushing the brake pedal, it almost goes to the floor before any braking happens, and the brake were bled.

[mygasser]

Apparently they are supposed to be Jag. But when pushing the brake pedal, it almost goes to the floor before any braking happens, and the brake were bled.

the rear will be jag as it has the jag irs but as the front's still 4 stud i'd imagine it's stock hunter brakes. does it have a single circuit master cylinder or dual circuit? again if it's stock single circuit then yes it'll have a lot of travel as the jag calipers need much more fluid than the hunter wheel cylinders would've.
neil.

[eviltwin]

You could be right about the front brakes, and it is a single circuit system. Probably original Hunter servo as well. It's something that needs to be addressed.

[mygasser]

sounds like you need at least a bigger bore single circuit master cylinder. that'll move more fluid reducing pedal travel. when you say the pedal goes almost to the floor before braking happens, what are they like at that point of almost being to the floor? is there a decent braking effort then or how does it feel?
neil.

[Happydaze]

My ageing memory tells me that the variants of that Rootes group car had phenomenally powerful brakes as standard...... I wonder if they had an eye into the future as to how their cars might be used? So presumably the jag rear is messing things up? I'd be thinking of somehow isolating the rears as part of a test. I'm also not sure about the idea that the jag calipers will take lots of fluid. Well they hold whatever they hold but the volume required to apply them will be quite modest. What does the pedal do if you pump it rapidly? My money is tentatively on a big air bubble somewhere. What's been the bleeding technique? So many variants and opinions! Suggest measuring the various bore diameters before swapping parts.

Chris

Sent from my SM-T515 using NSRA mobile app

[mygasser]

most all calipers use more volume of fluid to move the piston a given amount. that's simply because of area of the pistons, a caliper piston is much bigger area than a wheel cylinder piston. therefore to move a one inch square piston 1mm will take less fluid than it would to move a three inch square piston 1mm. basically the caliper holds more fluid than the wheel cylinder, it's all about displacement.
neil.

[Blackpopracing]

I'll throw a spanner in the works here, Phils pop that I did the brakes on has jag rears and Viva HA fronts with a single 5/8" M/c (no servo) and suprisingly the brakes are very good. So I'm not sure a bigger M/c will be the fix.

Bigger moves more fluid, but at less pressure.

I'm with Chris, there is probably a high point in the system that is holding air. Does the servo actually work?

[eviltwin]

the rear will be jag as it has the jag irs but as the front's still 4 stud i'd imagine it's stock hunter brakes. does it have a single circuit master cylinder or dual circuit? again if it's stock single circuit then yes it'll have a lot of travel as the jag calipers need much more fluid than the hunter wheel cylinders would've.
neil.

It has the stock Hunter madter cylinder with a single circuit.

[eviltwin]

My ageing memory tells me that the variants of that Rootes group car had phenomenally powerful brakes as standard...... I wonder if they had an eye into the future as to how their cars might be used? So presumably the jag rear is messing things up? I'd be thinking of somehow isolating the rears as part of a test. I'm also not sure about the idea that the jag calipers will take lots of fluid. Well they hold whatever they hold but the volume required to apply them will be quite modest. What does the pedal do if you pump it rapidly? My money is tentatively on a big air bubble somewhere. What's been the bleeding technique? So many variants and opinions! Suggest measuring the various bore diameters before swapping parts.

Chris

Sent from my SM-T515 using NSRA mobile app

I will have to check and see what happens when pumping the brake pedal fast, but Thunder Road Speed Shop bled the brakes. I am looking at different ways to improve the braking system, and I that many rods have had a similar setup.

[eviltwin]

So here's an update on the Hunter. As you can see, I have had some pinstriping done, and there will be some more done soon.
I will be having the brake master cylinder changed to a tandem system, as there was a definate leak. An adaptor will be fitted for the carb which has the PCV valve port.
I also need to get the electric power steering working, all of these jobs will be done at Thunder Road Speed Shop.

[tom.marg]

Where are you from? I’m sure it’s thunder road that’s not far from where I am?
Not a bad looking car keep the updates coming

[eviltwin]

Where are you from? I’m sure it’s thunder road that’s not far from where I am?
Not a bad looking car keep the updates coming

Cheers, there's definitely more to come.

I'm based in Farnborough, and Thunder Road is just in Woking.

[eviltwin]

I owned this around 10 or so years ago for a short time. It had been off the road for a long time and looking pretty sorry, but pretty solid considering.

Originally built by Andy (?) in the 70's/early 80s. Andy has now moved to New Zealand and is still 'into it'.

If my memory is correct - It came out in primer, then red, then black. It didn't change too much in terms of configuration from how it was back then to how I got it.

I went through a load of stuff in it - some wiring, rear axle freshen up, re-made the dash - the one that's in there now with the recessed rev counter and no other gauges, panels or badges on it, they hung from underneath. Got it ready for the road and sold it. It wasn't 'black magic' then, didn't have any murals, had more 'period' seats, an edelbrock intake/carb, an auto box and the original fuel tank still.

One of the 'features' that andy remembers fondly is the moggy minor front sidelight/indicator units - recessed by use of baked bean tin. I believe it's still in there

Here's a couple of how I got it, and a before/after of the dash. I'll see what else I can come up with.


(?)Attachment 63785Attachment 63786Attachment 63787

Looking at the photos of the dash, as it now, can you remember where the steering was from?

Cheers.